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    • Willow

      Welcome to the forum!   09/17/2017

      Please come in from the rain and sit by the fire! We're happy you found us and hope you will feel at home here.  

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  1. Today
  2. Well, what Jimmy did was and still is an offence in whatever country he did, but what Hans Asperger did was not a crime under the Nazi regime. Also, it was not revealed until many years after the end of Hans' life.

    Rather than barge in too much on the Hans Asperger Nazi thread, I think it does bring home what I tried to say here. When I first realised Asperger Syndrome had dominated my life, I was reading a lot of material and came to see it all as a badge of honour. I am still today not ashamed of my AS but I do see it now from the dark and lighter perspectives. Yes, Hans Asperger was working under the Nazi regime and, in reality, described the children as "little professors" but also highlighted some negative points. Such as bottled up anger. Somehow, modern psychology started to almost hush up the darker material and totally stress all the positive things. Although a big part of AS is for many a personality disorder, this aspect got stressed a lot to the point it became also a neurodiversity movement. This gave it a kind of plus that OCD or schizophrenia never had. In many ways I think T Atwood tended to stress the positive traits so that Hans Asperger and his studies became remote. Although people are shocked by the blunt observations made by Asperger I do think he did have the intelligence to deduce euthanasia of all those children would be folly. Studies showed they offered actual potential. Likewise it doesn't help me to be misled by modern psychology to the effect AS is a nerd syndrome, shared by the likes of Darwin and Spielberg. I've struggled with serious anger issues, lack of emotion, maybe a bit selfish even. I now know the bottled up anger described by Asperger is far better addressed. The empathy issue runs deep and very hard to deal with but, sure, at times I feel ashamed of being so cold and I admire NT friends who tend to be able to think more about others. AS hasn't made me a nice person but, on the other hand, I love animals and have my pluses.
  4. Yesterday
  5. Public honour for a man who is dead being revoked does not change what he did and his association with autism. Long story short, certain people who are that way inclined will always see Asperger's work with the Nazi regime and the condition itself as being linked in some way purely because of him. Likewise, some people will always distrust the BBC because of what Jimmy Savile did while working for them. By the way, I never said that I disagree entirely with the condition being renamed, but I am skeptical that it would make any real difference.
  6. When Jimmy Savile died, a beautiful and extravagant triple headstone was placed in Woodlands Cemetery, Scarborough in honour of his memory. Once it became known that he was a monstrous, child molesting scumbag, the gravesite was destroyed because relatives of other people buried in the cemetery were disgusted by its presence. Do you consider that to be historical revisionism too? As I've already said, I am not suggesting that Asperger's contribution to scientific research be expunged from medical journals or history books. I would hope that no one is. Those who wish to learn about his work and his contribution to the discovery of the condition for educational reasons may do so, just as those who - for whatever reason - wish to learn about the career of Jimmy Savile may do so. I fail to see how either of these cases come anywhere close to historical revisionism. The only thing being revoked is public honour, in line with facts that were unknown when that honour was initially given.
  7. Tylermc

    The Winnipeg Jets face off against the Nashville peradtors next week 

    at the next round of the NHL Stanley cup playoffs 

    go jets go 😊✈️😊

  8. Last week
  9. Hans Asperger - Nazi Child Murderer

    I took a chance on this and covered the story on the Russian autism forum. Hopefully it won't go down like a lead balloon. I think the background of what actually happened (if nothing else) is not overly complicated. I mean, Asperger wasn't doing anything to earn him the title of genius. These children were intelligent enough but highly problematic. In Austria they were going ahead with a mass euthanasia project so it was a matter of simply gathering medical information. Then, all Asperger had to do was observe what he saw: Stims, unorthodox IQ results, special interests, rages, empathy issues. To me it was a rough diagnosis. I'm sure if I'd been a child at that time I'd have been rounded up with the rest as "problematic". It wasn't like a modern diagnosis where they try to put a precise definition on the patterns of autistic symptoms. They seem to have left out the ESP part. I am well aware the Germans were also studying ESP and I am pretty sure Asperger would have been aware of that.

    You appear to be understanding more about yourself. There is a philosopher called Jiddu Krishnamurti who stated that to find the truth, look inside yourself. This is what I learned by myself and over the years. What I do is sort of freeze everything and adopt my psychologist role (as if observing), and very carefully try to describe how I feel, since when and ask why or how. I now fully understand what I experience and the extent if differs from normality. I also have a less politically correct view of Asperger Syndrome as I read a fair amount of criminal psychology files. I found AS is no different to either schizophrenia, borderline personality disorder or MPD in as much it sometimes is found in criminal profiles (as in mental illness). Here we have to tread carefully though. Although some criminal cases involved schizophrenia, schizophrenia was typical of countless genius musicians. Brian Wilson is schizophrenic yet a super talented musician and harmless guy. My point I guess is all psychiatric conditions can occasionally gather a destructive momentum, possibly aggravated by former abuse. That is another of my points: it seems so many of us suffered abuse due to being abnormal. Brian Wilson was beaten with a coathanger and worse from his father. I would like people to stop looking Aspergers as a sort of one dimensional "bed of roses" condition but realise it is occasionally destabilising. Actually I think percentage wise we do fall below NTs (lesser criminality) in our ranks but we are just not perfect specimens apart from other groups. Last point too I think the criminal psychologists misunderstand empathy. They view lack of empathy as a dangerous step towards criminality. I really disagree. When a tragic accident takes place I don't tend to cry and get emotional as other people expect. I will just think of cause, effect and solution. Often a lack of empathy is just analytical over-rides emotion. This is a far cry from the psychopath who charms people with good social skills but deep down will have no regard for life or ethics.
  11. Hans Asperger - Nazi Child Murderer

    It's kind of a moot point... as @Myrtonos said above AS isn't used as a diagnosis anymore (at least in the UK/US and presumably EU), it is all diagnosed as ASD now.

    I wish I knew. I think it's partly due to some negative symptoms of schizophrenia. I've had a few head injuries, so that may be related as well. Possibly concussions or closed head injuries. I believe a lot of my symptoms and conditions, like prosopagnosia and topographical agnosia are the result of something wrong with my temporal lobe. Maybe injury or damage to my temporal lobe area. DID/MPD is believed to have something to do with the temporal lobe as well. I had pretty poor coordination growing up. I've considered I may have dyspraxia, but I'm not sure. I haven't been diagnosed, but I do suspect that I have schizoid personality disorder and I'm diagnosed with avoidant personality disorder. I believe I have AvPD with some schizoid traits. I don't know how many alters I have because many of them aren't very distinctive. It's difficult to tell just how many there are, but I do have several.
  13. Asperger's syndrome has already been removed from the latest edition of the DSM, though it still gets a brief mention in the ICD.
  14. Dutch

    So Nesf and Riri both like to drink beer? Google Translate really does give away peoples secrets, or likes to have fun making things up

    I want to say it's very strange I had that drowning accident years ago. Just like in Carnival Of Souls. I was pretty close to death and my body only jolted when I was pulled out. The other strange co-incidence was I played organ. So, it adds up to a drowning accident, happening to play organ and a life-long feeling of not belonging to the world. Also, not only do I feel invisible but I have genuine experiences of not being detected. It's as if people are just very weakly receptive to my appearance. The only thing I don't have in common with Candice is I don't see ghouls although even that did happen once. A man in overalls. In some ways too I see the funny side. The part of the film that made me laugh was the woman-mad Mr Linden who had no idea Candice was sort of between two realities. During the scene at the bar he snaps at her: "You don't like the music. You don't drink. You don't like to dance. And you don't like for.a man to hold you close!"

    You do have prosopagnosia which is common with autism but I am baffled how you developed the other symptoms. How about coordination? Were ball games an issue at school? What about schizoid personality where the subject perceives no differences and feels little emotion? When you found you had MPD do you know how many alters there are?
  17. His actions were despicable but history cannot be revised. Simply put, whether the condition is renamed or not Hans Asperger will always be linked to Asperger Syndrome. Renaming the condition is in truth nothing more than a token gesture which will neither undo his actions for the Nazi regime or cut his ties with autism. As I said, history cannot be revised
  18. Mildly depressed, need encouragement

    I know what you mean. There is so much negativity these days. What I like to do is find an escapism which even just temporarily shuts out the real world. I like watching TV shows and films which are fictional, so things like superhero stuff, Star Wars, Doctor Who etc. Even if it is just for the time I am sat there watching them, it helps me to shut out the horrible stuff going on in the real world. As @spiderwoman0_2 said in the post above, do what makes you happy
  19. While I don't exactly relish the idea of having a condition named after a Nazi collaborator, it doesn't and shouldn't detract from the body of research subsequently conducted on Asperger's syndrome, even if it was in his name. This body of research has helped a lot of people like myself gain recognition, closure and support for a difficult life, due to having this condition. Whatever happened in the past doesn't change the present day reality for me and thousands of others with the condition. It doesn't change who I am, and it doesn't change my condition, or that of those affected by it. We need to take what we can learn from the past, and use that to build on and improve our present reality. In any case, the term Asperger's is to be dropped by the medical profession in favour of ASD. While the holocaust and other Nazi atrocities should never be forgotten, people will stop using the term Asperger's, and that will become a thing of the past.
  20. Yes, I had heard about this, and I do like their early pre-1971 stuff. Will definitely be watching out for this, hopefully they will be recording and releasing recordings of those concerts.

    In my case, I didn't stim when I was a child, fabrics on my skin never bothered me, and I didn't have any noise sensitivities. I developed sensory issues like noise sensitivity sometime after I became an adult. I had problem bonding with other kids when I was young, but that was because I had selective mutism. I was basically mute. I couldn't speak to any kids, so that's obviously going to make it hard to bond with other kids. I still had friends though when I got older.
  22. If you have access to the BBC I-Player you may want to watch a half-hour documentary called "Help Save My Child": https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b09zct6v/bbc-scotland-investigates-2018-2-help-me-save-my-child It's about the problems of several youngsters with autism who have major behavioural problems and / or serious mental health difficulties and the problems they and their parents have in getting appropriate education, health care and support.
  23. Mildly depressed, need encouragement

    I very rarely watch the news, I hate politics and to be honest I don't give a shit about any of it, all I bother about is my kids and family and what bit of the house to decorate next. Life is too short to think about all the sadness in the world, so stop thinking about it and do something that makes you happy
  24. You asked if having a disability is some sort of crime, and I said that these might have been disabilities not recognised at the time. And what is the right not to be gassed, poisoned, starved, etc? Who says people have the right not to be? Today, it is protected by laws of all democratic countries and by international laws, and these laws are enforced. That's what the people want and what the legislators have given them. But the laws of Nazi Germany, which was basically a dictatorship, didn't. But if I person is recognised as having a disability and "arrested" for it, they are not being arrested for a crime, they are being arrested for a disability. Whether this is right, or wrong, it is different from being arrested for a crime. This is not to make any moral judgements.
  25. Hans Asperger - Nazi Child Murderer

    Nobody really knows where Asperger's true political views lay but, yes, it's correct to say the whole Asperger phenomenon owes its research to the Nazi regime. Ultimately the idea was to eradicate all those children suspected of being imperfect. That includes the mentally ill. Asperger's job was to collect a range of children with obvious defects in order to determine whether they served any purpose whatsoever or should be eradicated. It seems clear what did interest the researchers about the children was the much discussed lack of "empathy" which I imagine appealed to the current party. Also the scientific bent of the children and the unorthodox intelligence test results. Not only was Asperger involved but also the Lebensborn children who were supposed to be a future perfect generation. I found out by curiosity one of my favourite actresses Marta Kristen was one of those children. The Nazi Party was deeply involved in the study of ESP so after the war defeat of Germany much of the research ended up in the USSR. Other research ended up in America so both the USSR and America used the research in Nazi Germany for the study of ESP. Not only that, but America's V" rocket (that saved the Apollo Space program) was a German research project. That includes most of the NASA Apollo team as well. From the original post, this seems to have come as something as a shock and probably upsetting. I think its safe to say these children would be used merely as a stepping stone to try and produce different types of human beings. There would have been some attempt perhaps to "breed out" the bad stuff such as the rages and stims but try and encourage the lack of empathy and the dedication to fields of interest. The good news? We are where we are today. Since those times I think we learned (or ought to have learned) it's folly to mess with nature and genes. Look at how German Shepherd dogs went on to develop severe hip mobility issues (it happened to my own Shepherd). Besides, I happen to think defects exist for a reason anyway. Someone elsewhere had this to say: "The torturous acts committed by the Nazis happened in the past, and I believe I speak for everyone else here when I say that they should stay in the past. Bringing up evidence from such unethical experiments into modern day research is wrong and disrespectful to those who have died, and those who survived, the holocaust. With over 14% of doctors in the U.S being Jewish, I doubt anyone would support examining the human experiments to find little to no new information." Maybe the feeling got strong enough to want to break from association with Asperger. "
  26. How is this relevant to their right to not be gassed, poisoned, starved, experimented on, and systematically murdered in the name of racial purity? You are drastically under-representing the severity of the situation. It's not impossible, but I reckon highly unlikely that anyone would be able to build a credible case to the contrary at this point. The only way of refuting these allegations that I can imagine would be to prove that the documents unearthed had been falsified. Who would have the motivation to do such a thing? That's true. I would hope that no one is suggesting Asperger's substantial contribution to medical research be minimised or erased from history. However, there are other conditions not named after those who initially discovered them, and important researchers whose names remain largely consigned to medical journals and history books. Their achievements in a medical context haven't been diminished, their names just haven't been honoured in such a publicly visible way. I'd say that's a perfectly fair and proportionate fate for the legacy of a man who willingly participated in the barbaric evil that befell hundreds of innocent children at the Am Spiegelgrund clinic in service of an insane, genocidal ideology.
  27. Tylermc

    Go wininpeg jets go 

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